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Post by iacon45 on Sept 23, 2018 10:42:25 GMT -5
I'm personally hoping if this movie is successful and warrants more movies, they go with reboot over just this being a prequel. I admit, the G1 designs do look good but I hope that as time goes on, they decide to let these movies be more their own thing and not just live action G1 style all the way through. The Bayverse did give us a decade of TF movies and did bring in more fans to the franchise but the movies had some pretty big flaws and to try to wrap these new movies around those, IMO, would be a big mess. Essentially the Bayverse movies seemed to be action scenes and explosions with a convenient script written around them instead of the other way around. Trying to keep BB a prequel to me would limit possible future movies because they would have to keep in line with what happens in those movies on down the line. Making it reboot would free up those restrictions. Not to mention by insisting this is a prequel eventually they would have to go back and tie up that big loose end at the end of TLK and I'd just rather they not. Again, I don't care if they decide to make sequels to BB more like a live action Cybertron, Beast Wars, RID 1.0, or something original moving forward and move away from established G1 characteristics and designs (hell, they could make Starscream a bitchy fembot for all I care), I just want a fresh start with good stories, coherent continuity, well thought out characters, and all without having to be bound by writing in line with what was to come in the previous Bayverse movies. I also don't want movies killing characters off for the sake of making room for new characters like the 86 movie or the Bayverse movies did. One or two deaths are fine if they serve a purpose or have meaning but don't make them empty or off screen. I'd rather see them rotate characters in and out or keep the cast small. But contradicting what I said about letting the BB movie and possible sequels their own thing, there is one aspect I would not mind seeing them carry over from Bayverse. Please can we have Hound back in these movies being voiced by John Goodman?
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Post by machsabre on Sept 23, 2018 12:03:31 GMT -5
I'm still 99.9% certain that if this movie is successful, it'll be serving as a soft reboot, like X-Men First Class. It can be a prequel, but then it'll just totally diverges from the original timeline.
Hopefully, they won't do what the X-Men movies did and bring back the original director. Days of Future Past (Quicksilver aside) was kinda overrated and Apocalypse was a bit of a mess.
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Post by Deinonychus on Sept 23, 2018 15:04:56 GMT -5
BUT. The Bayverse has been the most prominent piece of Transformers-related media for a decade now. That's long enough for a new target audience to get their start on this franchise (and we'll skip the debate on whether the movies are "age-appropriate" for now). So theoretically, there could be just as many younger fans upset that Bumblebee ISN'T a Camero now. I think it would be a mistake to throw away every visual or storytelling (straining a definition there, I know) concept from the Bayverse just for the sake of chasing after nostalgia-bucks from GeeWun purists. And, full disclosure- the movie isn't out yet & that may not actually be what's happening. But it certainly FEELS like that's happening based on everything we've seen and heard. I see your point, but I’d argue that this is more of an example of “Design Darwinism” than trying to cash in on G1 nostalgia. When all is said and done, the Bayverse designs for these characters are still confusing junkpiles with little distinction between one another. Really only Prime and Bumblebee stand out in the mind’s-eye as defined looks. (Conceivable Megatron, but his look changes so muc from film to film.) Perhaps the G1 designs have persisted the way they have because they’re just that good. And when I say “G1” I mean the Diaclone/Microman astetic. Otherwise we’d see a lot more Transformers with facial hair, rounded body features, or heavy teal, magenta, and neon green coloring.
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Post by SporkBot on Sept 23, 2018 16:52:19 GMT -5
I think the problem is that so much is going on with the Bay-former designs, there's nothing really to latch onto. Nice detail, but it doesn't leave in impression. The Cybertron games had a fantastic middle-ground, where they had basic polygonal elements to their chassis, but added in a few extra details to make them stand out. And that seems to be what this impending movie is going for.
But then, the fact that most of the TFs in the Bay films didn't really get much personality OR focus didn't help matters.
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Post by Greatshot on Sept 23, 2018 18:09:38 GMT -5
BUT. The Bayverse has been the most prominent piece of Transformers-related media for a decade now. That's long enough for a new target audience to get their start on this franchise (and we'll skip the debate on whether the movies are "age-appropriate" for now). So theoretically, there could be just as many younger fans upset that Bumblebee ISN'T a Camero now. I think it would be a mistake to throw away every visual or storytelling (straining a definition there, I know) concept from the Bayverse just for the sake of chasing after nostalgia-bucks from GeeWun purists. And, full disclosure- the movie isn't out yet & that may not actually be what's happening. But it certainly FEELS like that's happening based on everything we've seen and heard. I see your point, but I’d argue that this is more of an example of “Design Darwinism” than trying to cash in on G1 nostalgia. When all is said and done, the Bayverse designs for these characters are still confusing junkpiles with little distinction between one another. Really only Prime and Bumblebee stand out in the mind’s-eye as defined looks. (Conceivable Megatron, but his look changes so muc from film to film.) Perhaps the G1 designs have persisted the way they have because they’re just that good. And when I say “G1” I mean the Diaclone/Microman astetic. Otherwise we’d see a lot more Transformers with facial hair, rounded body features, or heavy teal, magenta, and neon green coloring. You pretty much covered everything I was gonna say, but I'd go one step further and say of them only Bumblebee is truly a distinctive movie design. Bay Prime is just another revision of the original, like, well, almost every Autobot leader/Convoy (with flames and more kibble) save Rodimus , but everything defining about him - the head design, the faceplate, the red and blue color scheme, that he turns into a truck, etc is pulled from the source. But the other big contribution is Barricade. And I like the designs for the most part, but I could go on a whole topic derailing rant about how the good ones were all wasted in barely on screen appearances, obscured by explosions and wiped out after one scene.
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Post by machsabre on Sept 23, 2018 21:33:54 GMT -5
To go along with what Deino said... Let's face it. G1 is iconic. Let's take Jazz. Here's every single incarnation of Jazz throughout the 30+ years of entertainment. (Show and comics only.) Just at a quick glance, you can tell with no problems at all that you're looking at Jazz. Even when it varies the color scheme, like the Alternators version does, you still know it's Jazz. But here's Movie Jazz. What the fuck am I looking at. Sure, color him like the G1 guy like the later toy did, and he's not bad... But Movie Jazz is one of the better versions of the movieverse designs! Starscream looks like a goddamned Dorito. Ironhide looks more like Trailbreaker than the ornery ol' cuss. Mirage looked more like Sideswipe than Mirage and Hot Rod? Christ, my wife thought it was Rattrap at first, with the way the head looks. I don't see this as pandering to GeeWunners as much as it's putting the superheroes in the costumes, as opposed to a three piece suit, armor or black leather again. Fuck off Blitzwing, you're not helping.
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Post by Deinonychus on Sept 23, 2018 22:41:17 GMT -5
I don't see this as pandering to GeeWunners as much as it's putting the superheroes in the costumes, as opposed to a three piece suit, armor or black leather again . Fleetingly had this thought myself, but it never fully developed. Got more caught up in the concept of how characters are constantly reimagined and rebooted these days. But how much can you change the look (costume) and personality, origin, abilities, etc, of a character and have it still be that character? If anything, going back to looks based more on the originals is just pulling the character back on-course after quite a few deviations.
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Post by Paladin on Sept 24, 2018 6:43:59 GMT -5
And now that this new trailer's out-
We get into my OTHER issue with the designs. Things don't appear to be internally consistent.
Look at the scene with the new Decepticons- Shatter & Dropkick- and then compare that with the Cybertron scenes. They look like they're from two completely different pieces of media.
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Post by Greatshot on Sept 24, 2018 9:46:13 GMT -5
I'm actually getting a bit excited for this now, but I both see and can agree with your point, Pal. The Cybertron scenes look like something based directly off of G1 (actually it reminds me a LOT of the old War for Cybertron game), whereas the earthbound 'cons (and Bee) seem more, well, movie based. They at least have color and personality, but they share a lot of those design queues, including the mechanical complexity bits.
On the other hand, I also see a half dozen instantly recognizable, iconic characters (except uh.. is the green seeker-dude Thundercracker?), AND Tetrajets! Freakin Tetrajets!
So I'm giving it the benefit of the doubt.
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Post by Deinonychus on Sept 24, 2018 10:32:07 GMT -5
Before work this morning at 6:15 AM I'm on TFW looking for the trailer when I scroll past the big screengrab of the Decepticons being lead by Shockwave. At which point I shouted "OH MY GOD!" in a dark and quiet house. Good way to panic the Wife and dog still trying to sleep
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